NITROUS OXIDE ( nos / n2o ) advice forum

Nitrous Oxide ( NOS / N20 ) Forum
 
It is currently Fri Sep 21, 2018 4:02 am

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 94 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2011 5:13 pm 
Offline
Wizard
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2008 2:14 pm
Posts: 911
Location: liverpool
holy moly! :mrgreen:

_________________
Ted


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Advertisement

Wizards of NOS Conact US
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 11:33 am 
Offline
Learner

Joined: Mon Dec 25, 2006 4:44 am
Posts: 412
Location: Prince Edward Island, Canada
Noswizard wrote:
We're ultimately aiming to use approx. 5 lbs of nitrous in under 4 seconds and in 1/8 mile. :twisted:


1600hp

You're probably going to be one of the first to investigate -10 AN feed lines!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 12:37 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
He has twin bottles and relatively short hoses, so we shouldn't need to resort to 10.
Also by the time we get to the 5lb in under 4 secs mark, I hope he'll have his bottles inverted and even shorter pipes, so the flow will be even better.
For now we're going to see how much we can flow through his dual 6AN lines and then increase them as and when needed.
The aim is to be up in the 1,000 HP region within 2 meetings, which should be in under 2 months time I believe and then be pushing the engines limits by the end of the season, which in Sweden comes quite early, so we don't have a lot of time.

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 1:41 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
Extract from customers report with my responses in yellow;

The plugs look fine, it can take a lot more timing for sure.
EXCELLENT – how does the distribution look from the plugs?

I will send you the pictures of the plugs soon.

This is the EGT readings, left is the start line numbers at start 4.800 rpm. Run 4.5 seconds and pass the line at 6.200 rpm, the numbers to the right, (engine idle 4 seconds before shutoff)
Cyl *** Start 4.800 rpm *** Finish 6.200 rpm
1 ********** 908 ****************** 1270
2 ********** 886 ****************** 1249
3 ********** 967 ****************** 1245
4 ********** 919 ****************** 1274
5 ********** 984 ****************** 1314
6 ********** 959 ****************** 1341
7 ********** 992 ****************** 1275
8 ********** 811 ****************** 1293

Looks very good, spread is within 7% and in my opinion way to safe……both fuel and timing!
They look IMPRESSIVELY CLOSE to me, they're even closer than they were at the start of the run by a substantial amount!!!!! :)

Plus as you say they look very safe

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 10:21 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
Interesting comparrison of EGT's with and without nitrous :twisted: - all comments welcome. :yes:

Image

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2011 5:02 am 
Offline
Learner

Joined: Sun May 22, 2011 8:40 pm
Posts: 76
Location: Kingston-Upon-Thames
The temp. increase in the exhaust gasses across all 8 cylinders on N20 compared to NA looks pretty uniform. Does this indicate that the nitrous supplied is being evenly distributed??

Also.. temp increase on N20 to NA is small... Enough air is being drawn in along with the Nitrous to suppress detonation??

I take it that's quite an achivement considering the volume of N20 flowed over a short period of time 8)
Reading into their reaction about the condition of the plugs is there room for advancing the timing also??


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2011 10:30 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
QuickStudy wrote:
The temp. increase in the exhaust gasses across all 8 cylinders on N20 compared to NA looks pretty uniform. Does this indicate that the nitrous supplied is being evenly distributed??
That's my interpretation of the figures but it's not only applicable to the nitrous but the fuel enrichment as well, which so far validates all our R&D work to determine the PERFECT distribution systems for both nitrous and fuel.

Also.. temp increase on N20 to NA is small... Enough air is being drawn in along with the Nitrous to suppress detonation??
I wouldn't say we can make the claim for detonation suppression due to an air flow increase yet, as we're only on relatively small power levels at present but as you say, the temp increases are relatively small, which I believe is mainly due to the lower combustion temps of the ethanol, that is being used as fuel enrichment.

I take it that's quite an achivement considering the volume of N20 flowed over a short period of time 8)
Getting such even distribution at ANY level I'd consider an achievement but we still have a long way to got yet, as the ultimate intention is to flow up to 10 times as much as was injected this past weekend and anything MIGHT happen between now and then. However, the good thing about the fuel side for certain (and the nitrous side potentially), is that my design/s SHOULD be LESS PRONE to distribution issues, as we ramp up the flow rates. :twisted:

Reading into their reaction about the condition of the plugs is there room for advancing the timing also??
Most certainly, as ALL the settings used this past weekend were EXTREMELY SAFE, due to the system only being fitted on the Thursday for qualifying on the Friday, WITHOUT ANY TESTING OF ANY KIND INBETWEEN.
He is now doing some belated testing and learning the extensive range of features the REVO/Max system offers, in readiness for his next race event.
:yes:

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 11:22 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
Just a brief note to say we're making good progress in getting work done to prepare the car for the next event, when the customer should be adding in the region of 500 to 700 HP, before cranking it up to the full shot at the race event after that.

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 3:50 am 
Offline
Learner
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2005 10:48 pm
Posts: 132
Location: USA
Interesting project Trevor - I'm curious to see how it pans out.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 1:58 am 
Offline
Learner

Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 7:50 pm
Posts: 345
...tfx datalogging ....

before you melt something. LOL


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 2:02 am 
Offline
Learner

Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 7:50 pm
Posts: 345
im curious to what the nitrous vs supercharged/turbo charged weights would be... i know that when i built turbo cars, we used GINORMOUS aluminum cells filled with ice, coils ran inside and antifreeze pumped through to keep the air temps down. it weighed ALOT by the time you added the entire turbo system, it was a big number. im sure this is lighter, but how much?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:45 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
xclr82xtc wrote:
...tfx datalogging ....

before you melt something. LOL

He doesn't have a TFX logging system but he does have the type the majority of the Pro Mod guys use (can't remember the name at the mo :( ), which is new and fully loaded as far as I'm aware. :twisted:

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:49 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
xclr82xtc wrote:
im curious to what the nitrous vs supercharged/turbo charged weights would be... i know that when i built turbo cars, we used GINORMOUS aluminum cells filled with ice, coils ran inside and antifreeze pumped through to keep the air temps down. it weighed ALOT by the time you added the entire turbo system, it was a big number. im sure this is lighter, but how much?

I don't know the weight comparrisons between blowers & turbos to nitrous but I do know the following;

1) The REVO system in this thread weighs in the region of FORTY POUNDS LESS than a conventional US 2/3 stage set up.
2) It cost Chris Patrick approx $150,000 to save approx. 1/4 of that weight by replacing other parts of his car with Titanium and ultra light weight alloy alternatives.

With the above in mind, it's worth switching to a REVO system JUST for the weight savings and money savings alone!!!!! :twisted: :twisted:

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 4:24 pm 
Offline
Learner

Joined: Sun May 22, 2011 8:40 pm
Posts: 76
Location: Kingston-Upon-Thames
I would imagine a huge turbo (or pair of) weighs quite a bit, not to mention all the pipe work, wastegates and intercoolers required to plumb such a setup..

Any news/data on how the car is running with more nitrous Trev?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:38 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
QuickStudy wrote:
I would imagine a huge turbo (or pair of) weighs quite a bit, not to mention all the pipe work, wastegates and intercoolers required to plumb such a setup..
Agreed and blowers aren't exactly light weight either.

Any news/data on how the car is running with more nitrous Trev?
The cars not due to run again for another couple of weeks but you can be sure I'll post a report as soon as I have anything to report.

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2011 5:09 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
The car is now running 500 HP max for this weekend.

Thankfully this customer is listening to my advice and as a consequence he made a 1/8 mile full power pass (on a 1/4 Drag strip) and coasted through to the 1/4, so he could check the plugs and data BEFORE doing a full 1/4 mile pass.
Unfortunately due to the usual new car bugs (NONE of which are nitrous related), he's only able to do THAT ONE run but thankfully, even though it was shut off at the 1/8 mile it was still quick enough to qualify him in 13th place out of 19 cars, so not a bad result under those circumstances.
EGT's & data logs all indicate PERFECT distribution still, so it's all systems go for the FIRST full power run over a 1/4 mile.

Unfortunately it rained all day today but there's hope that it will be dry tomorrow, so fingers crossed for that.

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced REVO system pics
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:11 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
The weather improved slightly and the cars FIRST full 1/4 pass (using JUST a 500 HP limit and EXTREMELY SAFE settings) was PERFECT!!!

Unfortunately the time wasn't quick enough to win the round but at least we now have some data to work from and dial the car in more accurately for the next event.

I'm not going to disclose the exact numbers just yet but I can say this, the result is AS QUICK as the TOP UK Nitrous Pro Mod car has EVER run and this is JUST THE FIRST TIME the car and driver have run a 1/4 mile on nitrous!!!!!

Were both VERY PLEASED with that!!!!!

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced Pro Mod car REVO system.
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 12:51 pm 
Offline
Learner

Joined: Sun May 22, 2011 8:40 pm
Posts: 76
Location: Kingston-Upon-Thames
Are the turbo and supercharger boys taking note yet?? I bet the owner has got a grin as wide as the Thames barrier.. :)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced Pro Mod car REVO system.
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:07 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
Yes the customer is EXTREMELY HAPPY and we're both looking forward to the next event but unfortunately that could be longer than we'd both like, due to the limited number of events at this time of year. :evil:

For the next event we'll either be running 700 or the full 1,000 HP and if that all goes to plan, I intend to upgrade the entire REVO system to flow in excess of 1,500 HP and with a bit of luck ramp it up to 2,000 HP.

For the record this nitrous system already has the capability to deliver the HIGHEST power figure, that ANY single stage nitrous kit has ever delivered. :twisted:

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced Pro Mod car REVO system.
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 7:08 pm 
Offline
Learner

Joined: Sun May 22, 2011 8:40 pm
Posts: 76
Location: Kingston-Upon-Thames
When and where is the next run likely to be Trev? Would love to see the car run as I'm sure others who are following this thread would! :)

What nitrous power level do you think you'll have to run to start beating the traditional power adders? (turbo/supercharger boys)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced Pro Mod car REVO system.
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:24 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
QuickStudy wrote:
When and where is the next run likely to be Trev?
That's in doubt at present but the car is based in Sweden, so it'll be somewhere over there until next year, when with a bit of luck the car will enter the European Pro Mod class and race in the UK rounds. With a bit more luck he'll be SERIOUSLY COMPETITIVE by then, so he'll be even more worthwhile to watch. :yes:

Would love to see the car run as I'm sure others who are following this thread would! :)
Likewise and I'll be going to Sweden sometime soon (probably for the next event), to assist and ensure that the car benefits FULLY from all the WON technology. :twisted:

What nitrous power level do you think you'll have to run to start beating the traditional power adders? (turbo/nitrous boys)
As CRAZY as this seems, it wouldn't surprise me if the car is competitive against MOST other nitrous cars on JUST the current 500 HP level, as he wasn't only using VERY SAFE settings but he's ONLY JUST GETTING STARTED WITH THE WHOLE CAR!!!!
Here's a few pertinent FACTS;
This is the owners FIRST year at this level of racing
The car was a Pro Stock car that he's rebuilt to Pro Mod spec, which itself is a MAJOR achievement, as there is VERY LITTLE in common between the 2 classes.
Prior to this week he'd ONLY made TWO EXTREMELY TENTATIVE 1/8 mile passes in the car.
This weekend he ONLY made TWO further passes on a 1/4 mile strip.
The first run of this weekend was only his THIRD run in the car.
It was also ONLY his FIRST run using the nitrous system to anywhere near it's BASELINE power settings and even then he ONLY used the nitrous for the first 1/8 mile and then shut off and yet he still qualified 13th out of 19 cars.
The second run was his FIRST 1/4 mile pass using the nitrous system for the full 1/4 and that was in COMPETITION CONDITIONS, which in itself is seriously demanding at this level.
DESPITE ALL the above, the car still EQUALLED the QUICKEST TIME ever posted by the UK's quickest nitrous Pro Mod car.

To put this achievement in to perspective, here's a list of factors that will without doubt require EXTENSIVE WORK, BEFORE OPTIMUM results are produced and would have SERIOUSLY IMPEDED his results this weekend.
Stock carbs settings
Stock timing settings
Nitrous system activation optimisation
Nitrous RPM range optimisation
Nitrous mixture
Nitrous timing
Max Extreme power and build time settings
Chassis set up
Suspension set up
Torque converter optimisation
Gearing optimisation
Driver optimisation

When he's on top of all that lot, he's then got to get a handle on EVEN MORE NITROUS!!! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

It's MY HOPE that at 'some' point as we ramp up the power the system delivers, that it will not only become the quickest nitrous car in the world but also the quickest car in it's outright class and if this car doesn't manage it, we have another customer with an even more capable car, that WILL get the job done as soon as he gets the car on the track.
:twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :yes: :yes: :yes:

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced Pro Mod car REVO system.
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 12:52 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
I forgot to mention that the first run that he was only using nitrous and under power for JUST half the track (before shutting down), was MASSIVELY out of shape to such an extent that the car was close to flipping and to correct that problem he increased the nitrous delivery and lowered the wheelie bars. On the next run the car ran PERFECTLY STRAIGHT for the full 1/4 and it was mainly because he was racing a blown car, that he was knocked out.

I mainly mention this because I'd forgotten to include wheelie bars in the list of factors that needed tuning to achieve optimum results and I'm sure there'll be more adjustment needed in that department as well as the other items on the list, that he hasn't even started on yet.

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced Pro Mod car REVO system.
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 8:44 am 
Offline
Newbie

Joined: Mon May 18, 2009 7:26 am
Posts: 11
Is this system only designed for a pro mod motor or could it applied to smalLer motors?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced Pro Mod car REVO system.
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 12:21 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm
Posts: 18700
Location: Doncaster
Dre Day wrote:
Is this system only designed for a pro mod motor or could it applied to smalLer motors?

Yes it can be used on smaller motors (exactly as it is), as long as there is enough room under the manifold.
If there is a problem with fitting it as it is to another style of manifold, I'll almost certainly be able to re-design it to fit most other manifold designs.

_________________
Regards

Trev (The WIZARD of NOS)

30 years of nitrous experience and counting!!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Most advanced Pro Mod car REVO system.
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 12:26 pm 
Offline
Learner
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2005 10:48 pm
Posts: 132
Location: USA
What did it run Trevor? I didn't see any ET/MPH??


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 94 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

  • Advertisement
Wizards of NOS Sparkplugs
Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group  
Design By Poker Bandits