NITROUS OXIDE ( nos / n2o ) advice forum

Basically as the title says

I'm looking to do as much research as humanely possible without going mad

With the changing of jobs I will have a bit more money to play around with in a year or so and am looking into possible upgrades for the F Something that no-one has really done yet that will make it a lot more fun off the gas and even more so on the gas

I've done the usual Google searches and read up on what seems to be the basics but any more direction greatly appreciated from people with first hand knowledge etc

Have you looked into the exhaust turbo kits that fit under the car??

http://www.intense-racing.com/rmturbokit/rmturbokit.htm

That's exactly the kind of thing I'm looking into I won't go into too much detail at the moment as I'm new to all this and it's just a thought in my head but looking at splitting the exhaust into two sides, small remote turbo on each and then to a backbox each with one tailpipe each (the car's got twin exits currently). Space looks like it's possible with two routes safely under the car but I need to research the rest to work pretty much everything out. I like a good challenge

Thanks for the link, I shall have a read

Hi

There are a couple of rear turbo Porsche 928s in the US...

They had no choice but to design theirs as rears as there is no room under the bonnet due to the huge V8, so its possible....

All the best Brett

Thanks That's just what I like to hear Managed to find some pics of it and it looks pretty good

http://www.clearimageautomotive.com/Por ... 0Turbo.htm

Somebody did it to a pug (i think it was a 306)and got it mentioned in PPC magazine. Was a nice looking conversion

Once you have the right size turbo, ANY will do as it is far enough away to not have exhaust gas temperature problems. THis also eliminates the need for an intercooler too!

HOWEVER as you have an F then the exhaust to turbo pipe wont be that long so it would be best to stick to a petrol turbo. Depending on location (I dont know the underside of an F so pics would be good hint hint) Then a small oil tank, pump and cooler just for the turbo might be the option. This takes away the need to pipe oil along with the air up and down the car. As you need an oil pump regardless then a cheep fleabay oil cooler and oil tank would fix the issue for you.

Getting the air inlet away from the back of the car would also be good. My turbo is already at the back of the car with my engine (like them Porka 911 things) and I have a few issues with mucky air filters and crud through the turbo.

Funnily enough I have been gathering pics today

These aren't of mine as it's not up on the ramps until Thursday but they help with getting a few ideas.









Am I right in thinking the best plan would be to split the manifold into 2 lots of 2 and then fit 2 smaller turbos for less lag and a bit extra power than one larger one? The other thing I'm not sure about is whether I will need a cat (or two) and backbox (or two)? This is the one I have fitted currently and could easily have another made up to fit them both in the space where it is now



Kind of like this but with two pipes coming in instead of the one large one



Obviously I will be stripping the engine down and building it back up with a lot of non-standard parts Is it best to work out the turbo/s and what power they will be putting out and building the engine to stand that (and nitrous) or spec the engine first and then choose the turbos based on that?

Lots of things to do with not a lot of knowledge (yet) and not a lot of money

I'd suggest you just change the engine to one that makes more power

Honda K series, VAG 1.8t etc should all work & are much better than the lump of chocolate you have in at the moment

Bill

Nah, where's the fun in that

engine swap would be a good option IMO, the biggest problem with remote chargers is the oil return cant go back to the sump as the turbo normally sits below the oil level line

seems to be popular in the states though for some reason

Keep 'em coming It's comments like that that is one reason I'm sticking with the engine To prove it can be done and because no-one else has

(said in a playful tone just incase it comes accross as having a dig )

The engine will be rebored to 1.9l, steel crank, banded liners, forged pistons & rods, remote thermostat fitted with electric water pump and looking into fitting studs to replace or work alongside the headbolts for a bit extra stiffness. No doubt there will be more but that's what i've looked through so far

Dan stick with the K ! If we all did what everyone else said it would be boring! I think what you are doing is great - and if you hang with Pel's Crew at the pod your bound to get more ideas!

As for swapping motors Ive been told loads of times on various forums (including here) to swap my motor - ATM I am sticking with my 1.3 Skoda engine (Cold war Czech behind the back seat) I am not considering anything else although it has been suggested.

Anyway back to the F

Looking at the Zorst, I reckon go for a single unit. Adding 2 doubles hassle, parts and needs more space. Joining the inlet again to go into the manifold could lead to problems as it could lead to one turbo spooling and possibly stopping the other with blowback? (dunno on this but just looking at the plumbing gives me this theory) Or you need to split the intake manifold, then 2 TB's for 2 turbos and all sorts of hassle with that.

Maybe a t2 from a Saab 900/9000? There are loads in the scrap yards and they do provide decent boost with only a small amount of lag. Also most of the bits you will need are available.

Does your K have a metal Throttle body? You would be better with metal as it will take the heat easier just block off the breathers to it by connecting a piece of pipe from one to the other. (and metal dont melt if you backfire speaking from experience - I use a K body on my Skoda as I dont use petrol)

The reason I say a t2 is that the 2.0 saab has a t2 and all the 2.0 and below conversions that I have seen that worked well were all t2. The metro had a t3 on it but they are hard to find and therefore expensive. Also if its cheap then you can always change it later for a bigger turbo:yes:

Also a turbo quietens down the engine loads so you wont need so much exhaust to kill sound....... Giving some more room.

Building the engine to take it then adding a turbo could be a good move - depends on how long it will take. Most of the turbo in the tail conversions I have seen didnt need much in the way of rebuilds as they were all relatively low boost (below 10 psi)

Put the intake on one side and the exhaust on tother - left side 'exhaust' sucks, right side blows (less piping)

At the PPC Challenge we saw a rover 200 with a turbo conversion. It worked but didnt seem that good - his times were not much better than standard. He had a HOOGE turbo and very industrial piping (well they were tractor mechanics) I am not sure how they overcame fueling etc but I think they remapped.

What are you looking to do about fueling? Are you going to an aftermarket ecu or just bigger injectors and higher fuel pressure?

ANd probably the other questions I should ask is HOW much you want?

Do you want big boost with the engine revving up to its 7000 or so limit?

Or would you settle for lower revs having more power on tap?

Unless Saab have changed their turbo's around a lot, Saab 900 turbo's are T3's which would work really well actually! Me & a mate built up a turbo setup on his 1.6 vtec CRX using a Saab 900 T3 it spooled really well but ran out of poof at 7500ish RPM so would suit your Rover engine I'd say. We ran 7psi of boost with a remapped ECU & larger injectors mapped by me to be very safe & it was a hoot

Bill

Wow, thanks. I didn't expect a reply that detailed

Where to start

I can see your point about joining the inlet again, hadn't really thought that one through too much. The current throttle body is the bigger 52mm alloy one so that should be ok Individual throttle bodies perhaps with each inlet running to two throttle bodies? Might be a bit tight on space and i'd imagine I'd actually have to cut into the boot space but that wouldn't be the end of the world

The Saab option sounds like a good one, not a lot on eBay but I could be searching for the wrong thing. This is what I had come up - http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Saab-900-GM-9-3-A ... 588b0a0513 I am more than happy to go scrapyard searching though, no better way to spend a Saturday morning

I am toying with the idea of perhaps fitting one turbo to the car now and running low boost to keep the power just shy of 200bhp, that's roughly what I'm running with the nitrous now and it seems reliable enough (famous last words ) Just to get it up and running and see how it feels with the turbo and make sure it can work.

Fueling I am planning to go with swapping the ECU for, most likely, an Emerald as it can control the VVC mechs as well as do pretty much anything else I could ask of it. Not cheap but then neither is another engine when the fueling messes up and it goes bang

As for how much do I want..... Not fussed about big top end power numbers, I would ideally want more power on tap throughout the rev range without it falling off at the top but the lower end is what i'm after



Thanks, that sounds like just the thing What were the power/torque figures before and after? Anywhere around a 40-50bhp increase would be about right until any engine work is done

If I didn't have a wedding to go to this weekend then I know where I'd be spending it

Hi Dan

Yep just the thing but scrap yard searches are cheaper (if you have the time) Should be 8mm nuts holding it on (13mm spanner) so not too hard to get off and taking all the pipework as well is VERY handy (you will need dump valve etc but all the bits are there)

Bill is right its a t3 - my bad

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Thanks I shall head over to one up near me next Saturday and see what they have I now have a confirmed start date for my new job so can hopefully start getting some of the bits together soon



Woohoo! I can have the money to do this project in no time

This site really could do with "highpower systems" spam filter..........

Very true, but unless I'm missing it I don't see a link anywhere? So this bloke stuffed up.

Paul

Just to update this thread slightly (nothing too exciting )

Have just purchased this:



T25, no play anywhere that there shouldn't be and no smoke or oil in places where there shouldn't be

Just awaiting delivery and then it will be time to work out measurements and get a list of parts together. I have an old downpipe that I will be cutting up to join up to the turbo and replace the cat so then it will just be the intake pipework, oil feeds etc and the two most expensive parts of the build: One of these - http://www.emeraldm3d.com/em_k3.html and something like this - http://www.advancedvehicletuning.co.uk/ ... cts_id=203

You be ready for May then Dan?

I like that chargecooler! water to air always a nice way to go!

I don't know if the turbo will be done in time for May or not but I will be there I've just bought a wideband lambda and am looking at a fuel pressure regulator so may be able to get it up and running with low boost before getting the Emerald I'm looking at whether I can make a charge cooler myself and do it a bit cheaper and sooner

Those barrel intercoolers are made here in Oz. http://www.pwr.com.au/#/view=products/s=is/ The Bosch water pump is fantastic, I have 2 of them on my water/air intercooler with custom dry ice box, which I have never used the dry ice part ,and it is being removed from the car to make way for a fuel cell. The Bosch pump was the equivalent of £140 your money so it is a pretty pricey part.

Paul

Just thought I'd resurrect this thread as I took a long awaited delivery yesterday

A not so exciting box



Now what was inside is a little more interesting









Garrett T25 from a Rover T series. Just got to make sure it will fit where I intend to put it and then onwards with the project hopefully

It does mean that I will be selling my WON kit though until after I have fitted the turbo and got enough money together to rebuild the engine with forged parts and buy another one I do plan to keep it until May though so that I don't miss out on the fun at the Pod