NITROUS OXIDE ( nos / n2o ) advice forum

hi guys thought i would post up a couple pics of my WoN kit, only used a 100 jet which gave me 48bhp in the end, im pretty happy with the results as gives me a nice boost in torque just when its falling off normally

Thanks for the post and I assume you mean a jet number of 100 (which is 50 BHP) and in that case it looks like a very good result, especially as it looks like a 50/51 BHP increase between 8,000 & 8,500 ish.

What type of ECU are you using and I assume the fuel delivery has been mapped to match the nitrous delivery?

Do you have anything showing the AFR during the run?

yes i believe its the 100 jet although need to confirm this, im happy to be honest as one of the week points of the K20 is a lack of torque imo so this helps nicely was thinking of changing to a 150jet but dont want to push the internals to hard so might give it a miss

im using the Hondata K-pro ECU (& some larger injectors) which is controlling the additional fuel injection and prevents the Nitrous from coming on before 6000rpm then cuts it off 200rpm before redline if i remember correctly

unfortunately no i don't have the afr readings however if your interested i would be more than happy to do a quick run with the nitrous and running data logging from the K-Pro, not sure if there will be anything of interest on there for you. Alternatively i will be at the Jap Show at Santa Pod on the 3rd - 4th of July running in the HKS Series so if you would like to take a look at the car please feel free!

Thanks for all that and if you could do a run and log the AFR I'd be very grateful if you could post that for me.

Your engine should easily handle a 75 HP shot but you'd be better to do that progressively.

75 shot on an already boosted type-r!? are you sure?!

will run data logging on sat during a couple test runs and post it up for you, not sure if my afr changes much on the graph. says something about being closed loop, not entirely sure what this means?

Closed loop could mean one of 2 things;

1) It normally means that under anything EXCEPT full throttle the AFR feeds back to the ECU so that the ECU can adjust the mixture to keep it at the desired level.

2) It might mean that under all conditions the above applies (as is the case with the latest Max Extreme feature) and if that was the case then there shouldn't be much variation if any, so we should be able to determine which it is from your results.

did this run at the weekend, light green shows N2O on and red shows a/f ratio, the target ratio is slightly different but i can get you an example if you like?

Thanks for posting that info and that explains why modern ECU controlled dry systems work so well, as AFR trace clearly displays that closed loop Lambda control WORKS WONDERS.

I've long been a believer that with modern cars that have closed loop fuel correction, you could throw in virtually any amount of nitrous with or without extra fuel (within reason) and the management would self adjust to deliver optimum results. Unfortunately I haven't had time to determine to what extent that is likely to be true and as its likely to vary from vehicle to vehicle, I decided it was unwise to work on the basis that most would work to some degree (as certain other companies have been prepared to do), without KNOWING a lot more, so we've stayed with proven principles instead.

Those results also indicate that our closed loop AFR feature in the Max should also deliver the goods and I only say 'should', because as yet we haven't had anyone use it in such a way as to prove it conclusively.

Thanks again

Trev I think you might be getting the wrong end of the stick.

The Hondata ECU has the same features as the Hondata I'm using in my car tho it's a different version so I'm aware of it's features. The ECU controls the activation of the nitrous & then adds a fuel trim table to the map as well as an ignition trim table if needed

Some modern ish ecu's will do what you expect tho I'm sure.

HTH

Bill

Hi Bill,

Thanks for the post and yes I'm aware of all that but I can't believe that anyone could achieve A PERFECTLY CONSTANT AFR by mapping adjustments alone, therefore such a result must be as a consequence of closed loop AFR adjustment.

If you know otherwise I'd be happy to hear about it and marvel at the ability of any tuner who managed to do that.

I posted from my phone earlier & couldn't make out the AFR trace clearly.

I'd suggest that there's no wideband plugged into the ECU on that data log.

I've use the auto tune feature on my mates ECU to get his on boost AFR's really smooth but that looks to be reading a generic 14.7 across the full datalog

The auto tune feature is the future for fine tuning a map I love it!

Bill

heres a quick vid of the quickest 1/4 mile ive managed on road tyres with my WON kit, im 1 minute 20 into the video! 13.16 is fairly respectable for a fwd car on road tyres i think so im happy, next year i will be upping the nitrous to a 150bhp shot and getting some slicks so will really see what she can do!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cP2qJAQH_EA&hd=1

That`s a good E.T. on street tyres. Congrats. Wish my CTR had that speed. Can`t even get below 14 seconds with a 100 bhp shot. Must be doing something wrong.

I`m wondering, are the internals of your engine stil stock?

EXCELLENT and there's got to be a 12.8 in it even as it is with some more practice on the starts and a bit more nitrous in sooner.

yes stock internals but having the bottom end built soon so will be able to handle more nitrous cant wait to have 150-200bhp extra on tap!




i expect your right if i had it progressively fed in through first and second should knock a few tenths off! i know a car with a similer setup but slicks is just about to break into the 11s so im hoping to run similer times with my slicks on

OP: Any updates on this?

currently running the stock internals still with JRSC, had a big end bearing go so thats set me back a little. Also had the final drive changed to help speed up acceleration as ive decided to move to circuit racing next year which i wont need the n2o for

got some slicks sat in the garage so next time i go up the pod i should be able to get some better times in, im hoping for somewhere in the region of low 12s or high 11s will let you know in the new year how i get on. Im considering moving up to a 100bhp progressive shot on the stock engine but that will take me to 400bhp on stock internals which is risky!

thought i would post up a shot of my new nitrous map, increased power by a little bit going to see how it runs down santa pod soon then decide if i want to run a little more



Sorry forgot to say, the prog controller is set to start at 55% and increase to 100% over 2.5 seconds

Looking good what size jet are you using?

not sure to be honest, i had the tuner sort it all out for me it made about 75bhp though which im very happy with, cant wait to get using it now

Going by those graphs it made almost 100 HP & 80 FTLBS EXTRA at one point.

I should say it was on 120octane race fuel though to be extra safe! How often would you recommend getting the pulsoids serviced? Mine could probably do with Checking

I believe this is a dry system, so you should never need to service a nitrous Pulsoid but it would be wise to replace the filter now and again, plus it doesn't harm to have the Pulsoid inspected for peace of mind every year or so, especially if they are a few years old already.

You might even like to consider trading yours in and upgrading to an X-10.

hmmm will have to have a read and see what the benefits of upgrading to the X-10 system will be pretty happy with my currently results so not sure how much it will improve things?